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Vinyl Flat & Groovy Pouch

Discussion in 'Audio Hardware' started by DR.J, Nov 5, 2012.

  1. Jam757

    Jam757 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Seattle
    Unfortunately I could not seem to get a good picture of it so I said screw it and flattened it - 4 hours on medium setting. So it is amazingly flat and acceptable for playback although you can hear some noise on quieter passages pretty much throughout. Still, overall, a nice sounding record and I'm glad I didn't toss it. The first rotations on each side are certainly the most affected.
     
  2. Kevin j

    Kevin j The 5th 99

    Location:
    Seattle Area
    I’ve melted a few records now in my pouch. The latest was an original pressing of “What’s Going On”. It had a nasty edge warp. I put it in the pouch twice for 2 hours but no change, so I put it in for 7 hours and it melted. I only paid 2 bucks for the album but I’m still bummed. I think my pouch runs hot.
     
    Preston likes this.
  3. Jam757

    Jam757 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Seattle
    7 hours is way to long. You probably should have increased to 4. I have had really good results with 4 hour sessions on medium heat and then let cool overnight before removing.
     
    Kevin j likes this.
  4. Jam757

    Jam757 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Seattle
    Also, forgot to add, that nasty edge warps are indeed very difficult to remove. Those are the worst ones. I have removed some pretty big ones but usually with some audible wooshing noise each rotation where it passes the warp. Still, it does make a record at least playable.
     
  5. Piero

    Piero Forum Resident

    Location:
    Italy
    It manages to flatten dished 180 gr records?records convex on a side and concave on the other.
     
  6. I have done something similar in the past, i.e. increasing the time in the pouch significantly. Usually not a good idea. I have ruined a few that way.

    I usually start at 2 hours and increase in 30 minute segments these days.

    If there is no success at the 4 hour time limit, I usually stop there and consider that record not be fixable.

    One thing I have started to do recently, if the warp is pretty significant: Approx. 15 to 30 minute after the timer has turned off the power (so that the vinyl flat is not at the peak temperature anymore but still warm, I tighten the wing nut quite a bit more (I don't tighten it very much before I start heating). Sometimes I let it sit with the tightened nut for a day or longer after it has cooled down.

    I am not sure if this makes a difference, but I was able to improve one record where two or three previous runs were not really successful.
     
    riverrat and Kevin j like this.
  7. Yes, these usually come out really well, especially if they are newer pressings (with old records, you can never be sure what you get).
     
  8. David P. Hill

    David P. Hill Forum Resident

    Location:
    Irving, Tx
    Do you lay a flat, medium weight object on the pouch while cooling overnight to be sure it doesn't warp again, just wondered?
     
  9. tim185

    tim185 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Australia
    I have done 6-8 hours multiple times , multiple records, no problems at all. But you guys make me nervous.
     
  10. riverrat

    riverrat Forum Resident

    Location:
    Oregon
    I just baked a copy of Pharaoh Sanders Tauhid, original RVG Impulse, overnight. :eek::eek:

    It had an edge warp, more of a deformation really. Looked like one edge of it stayed close to a heat vent too long or something. It wasn't only warped vertically, but also slightly deformed horizontally.

    The first few runs didn't help, the normal 2-4 hours. Still skipped badly. So I put it in overnight, with binder clips along where the damage was.

    It came out OK. I've always had the impression my particular groovy pouch runs a bit cool. The record actually plays without skipping now, although the whole arm jumps side to side a little bit on every rotation due to the horizontal deformation. But it stays in the groove (with some of the aforementioned whooshing at first) and tracks normally by a minute or two into the track. (AT155LC cart running a AT440 MLA stylus, tracking at 1.5 grams.)

    I'm pleased to finally be able to listen to it, but wonder if playing records like this would eventually damage the stylus suspension.
     
  11. Preston

    Preston Forum Resident

    Location:
    KCMO Metro USA
    Wow. You may be right. I put a meat thermometer in my pouch once to see how hot it got (not very scientific, I know) and if I remember correctly, it never got above (around) 125 degrees. Some of the heat leaked out due to not being able to seal very tightly around the thermometer, but I would assume 135 degrees F tops. I've left records in for 24 hours with no ill effects. So far.
     
  12. Kevin j

    Kevin j The 5th 99

    Location:
    Seattle Area
    I need to put a thermometer in mine to see how hot it gets. I had some success with a Dead Moon reissue this week...I put it in the pouch for 2 hours then left it clamped in the vinyl flat for a few days. Warp gone!
     
    Preston likes this.
  13. vinylsolution

    vinylsolution Forum Resident

    Location:
    Denver, CO, USA
    I elevate mine a bit, set the Groovy Pouch on a small riser - like a bowl, so that the pouch does not touch anything nor get additional thermal "help" from what it would be lying on.
    I put an oven/bbq thermometer probe inside mine so I can monitor the temperature, it seems to be pretty consistent around 118-120 degrees F.
    (but of course, how calibrated is my probe? take with a grain of salt)

    I have a 24-hour timer with push pins you can set each hour on or off, so I do 6 hours on, 6 hours off, 6 hours on, 6 hours off.
    This gives it plenty of time to cool between cooks.
    I have never ruined an LP with this approach, and, seldom does it take that long... many times one 6-hour session is all it needs.

    Edge warps and flimsy thin (think Dynaflex) albums are the most difficult in my experience.
    Thicker 180gr (like every single VinylMePlease album I ever received!!!) do well with just one cooking session.
     
    DeRosa and Preston like this.
  14. Artdob

    Artdob Forum Resident

    Getting some unwanted issues in my use of Vinyl Flat. On the one hand, I've had generally good experiences with the unit in flattening out warped records. Variables that come into play for sure are the amount of warp, the weight or thinness of the record, the length of time and temperature used, etc. I've noticed that if there is any dust or particles on the rings which surround the record, that upon the heating process being finished, I can see the shape of those particles almost baked into the record. A couple of records where I've seen this, have played fine, but I'm not liking this artifact of the process. Not sure if anyone else has experienced the same. My next attempts will include finding ways to get the black rings as clean as possible prior to heating - thinking about running a carbon brush over the rings, and maybe a lint roller as well.
     
    Jim in Houston and rjstauber like this.
  15. LitHum05

    LitHum05 American Expat Audiophile

    Location:
    Taipei, Taiwan
    This is turning into mad science. But still, I'm considering buying one of these...
     
    Jim in Houston likes this.
  16. Do you have felt type rings (like a felt turntable mat) or solid plastic rings?
     
  17. Artdob

    Artdob Forum Resident

    Mine are solid plastic rings. Does Vinyl Flat have another option with felt materials?
     
  18. richbdd01

    richbdd01 Forum Resident

    Location:
    London
    Im getting results flattening LPs by just leaving them in my storage unit...
     
  19. David P. Hill

    David P. Hill Forum Resident

    Location:
    Irving, Tx
    They flatten theirselves out in their storage unit, vertically? How does that work?
     
  20. richbdd01

    richbdd01 Forum Resident

    Location:
    London
    Stored upright together over a period can flatten fairly minor to moderate warping depending how long left....in my experience. The Peter Gabriel ‘Up’ 45rpm reissue I got was quite warped. Stored it away and didn’t listen to it for about 9 months. It looks significantly flatter to me. It’s nothing to even bother about now, but I was irritated when I first bought it.

    A lot might depend on the vinyl thickness aswell.
     
  21. David P. Hill

    David P. Hill Forum Resident

    Location:
    Irving, Tx
    I'm the same way about my records, they are expensive!
     
  22. Vinyl Addict

    Vinyl Addict Forum Resident

    Location:
    MA

    Yes. The newer "Groovy Rings" are made of felt.
     
  23. nosliw

    nosliw Azunyan! にゃーーー!

    Location:
    Ottawa, ON, Canada
    Yesterday, I got the Vinyl Flat and Groovy Pouch for free from someone from my local classified ads website. Although it's missing the important pieces of accessories (the Groovy Rings, the screws and washers, etc.), I'm planning to get them from the manufacturer themselves.

    As soon as I get all the important accessories and a mechanical timer countdown, I'll try the Vinyl Flat myself and hope for the best with my warped records in my collection.
     
    Vinyl Addict and MrRom92 like this.
  24. MrRom92

    MrRom92 Forum Supermodel

    Location:
    Long Island, NY
    I came across what would’ve been a nice Trojan press of “Hot Shots of Reggae” that unfortunately had not 1, but 2 edge warps. The thing looked like a Pringle! It seemed there were other records in the collection with severe heat/fire damage, to the point of there being some records with actual holes melted through them...

    That 1 LP I wanted wasn’t as bad as many others, relatively speaking. Still not looking good at all though, so I passed… but it got me thinking. What is the most severe warp you’ve been able to take care of with a Vinyl Flat? I would have been content just minimizing it to a trackable state, but I didn’t feel it was worth the $2 to try and experiment with.
     
  25. Vinyl Addict

    Vinyl Addict Forum Resident

    Location:
    MA
    I've fixed some pretty bad vinyl
     
    elvismcdouglas likes this.

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