Surrounded On Sundays - 5.1/quad reviews and summaries

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by mark winstanley, Jun 15, 2019.

  1. NorthSide

    NorthSide Well-Known Member

    I have 42 titles that you've reviewed so far of my total of 180ish collection, I like the way you've set this up format wise. It's very helpful also to have the current market pricing for anyone looking to acquire a missing disc. I get more information from your reviews in a non bias way, better than these videos I've seen recently that aren't up to snuff and I just can't take much of the presenter (Not that he isn't trying, I just reach my limit fairly quickly) fingernails on a chalkboard. Ha.... Keep up the good work and I'll figure out how to vote for one for you to review soon.
    dougb222, jamesc, Jarleboy and 6 others like this.
  2. mark winstanley

    mark winstanley 5.1 should be mandatory for my favourite albums Thread Starter

    To me the idea here was that I have been burned many times paying big bucks for a 5.1 mix .... that somebody's deaf younger sibling could have done a better job mixing. So I wanted folks to be aware what they are getting, as much as possible.
    Also I needed to retrain myself into listening, as I had noticed that I had become a vague listener .... hearing but not really listening. So I wanted to put myself in a situation where I have no option but to really listen.
    It is an interesting exercise that makes me make time, instead of excuses :)

    As for voting.
    Each week I will put up ten albums, just like whatever ones you would like to hear about. On Sunday I will review the album with the most votes, and sometimes others off the list also, but at the moment I am way behind on listening to some of my purchases, so I am selfishly throwing those in as I am able. For example, on Tuesday I will get Miles Davis, Live Evil delivered, and all things being equal, on Sunday I will almost certainly be running through that one.

    Please feel free to correct or rebut stuff too. I started off a little too gentle on the mixes, and the guys set me straight with counter-reviews I guess you would call them. Obviously everyone has different tastes and expectations, so input can help give people a wider critical overview. I am also not an audiophile, so someone with better ears (ears like I used to have .... boo hoo) may have a better perspective on some stuff.

    Mainly, join in and have fun, because that is what music should be anyhow :cheers:
    jamesc, GerryO, Juggsnelson and 6 others like this.
  3. riskylogic

    riskylogic Forum Resident

    Coltrane and Santana - Illuninations I've had this for two years without realizing it had a multichannel version on it. So, I'm listening to it for the first time today. It's not an album I had before, nor have I had either of the other two Devadip Santana albums. I do have the album he did with John McLaughlin, Love, Devotion, and Surrender, which is of the same ilk. I've listened to the stereo layer several times and I like it a lot. Anyway, it's a very nice ethereal mix. I will probably just be listening to the quad version from now on. (2/3)

    I think the quad layers on the DV releases are the versions created in the 70's - which is why we are getting a bunch of 70's quad albums from them. Discogs doesn't say who mixed the original 1974 LP either. In addition to more Santana, I hope DV can dig up some of the old Johnny and Edgar Winter quad releases.
  4. Mister Charlie

    Mister Charlie "Music Is The Doctor Of My Soul " - Doobie Bros.

    Aromas, CA USA
    The Guess Who - Wheatfield Soul/Canned Heat

    Just released on Dutton Vocalion, a 5.1 two-fer (well, quad with LFE info).

    Can be ordered directly from Dutton (in the UK), only 11.99 pounds (about $14, $15 USD) store: The Guess Who - Wheatfield Soul & Canned Wheat [SACD Hybrid Multi-channel] | New releases - Popular | CDSML8570 | Amazon US has it but for $21 bucks plus $4 for shipping.

    I bought this for Wheatfield, having never heard Canned Heat (but already knowing 4 of the songs on the album, like Undun). Wheatfield is a long time favorite of mine so being in surround sound, it was an automatic purchase.

    I am just giving a few impressions of the overall listening experience, rather than a song by song breakdown:

    Definitely a discrete mix, drums are bolted to the rear right speaker. At first this is a bit off putting but before long it just fits in fine.
    The original quad mix is like many quad mixes of the day. The album starts out with some brief and tasteful moving around of secondary elements from front to rear and back again. This gimmick is fine on side one; by side two one has tired of the constant swirling around of elements in the mix.

    Since I love the album anyway, and I love surround sound, I am still quite happy with this release. Canned Heat was a bonus, icing on the cake (I already have the Guess Who Greatest Hits in surround sound), with hits like No Time, Laughing and Undun.

    My hearing at 67 is typical, so I don't want to really comment on the sound except to say on first listen it seemed a bit muffled or bassy, but my second listen didn't strike me that way so YMMV.

    I was amazed to be able to hear the timbre of the bass strings on When You Touch Me, the clean mix is great to hear, although it tends to separate the elements a bit, which means you can hear everything that is going on in the music but it loses a tiny bit of cohesiveness. Friends Of Mine sounded good (the echo on the word GOD is different) especially with the swirling elements.

    The mix is very dry. That is the other thing, hearing the dryness and the clarity is illuminating as to techniques and instruments used but takes a bit of the original 'sound' away. But as a different mix entirely, it is very good, I would buy this again (though my love for the album is probably why, not as much for the surround experience which is fine but a bit dated).
    dougb222, GerryO, Juggsnelson and 4 others like this.
  5. Sordel

    Sordel Forum Resident

    Midlands, UK
    I'm not even a casual Kraftwerk fan, but 3-D is one of my favourite BR possessions, both for the 3D (which is spotty in places but best-in-class at times) and for its soundtrack, which is state-of-the-art in 5.1 and I look forward some day to hearing in Atmos. Since Mark focused on The Man Machine I'll do the same.

    First, a general comment that holds true for the project as a whole: this surround is all about enveloping sound, not so much about specific channel placement. The only place I've heard a better soundfield was live at the Stockhausen concerts in Amsterdam last year, listening to a system that probably cost hundreds of thousands of pounds featuring 16 channels of matched PA speakers arranged through 360°. With the Kraftwerk, similarly, the sound is all around you so that the instruments are no longer locatable: that might be irritating with acoustic instruments but it's just right for electronic ones.

    Musically, things get off to a good start with the title track. Kraftwerk’s sound scales well to speakers in the sense that it sounds very tinny on small speakers and comes alive as you get some decent bass extension and mass. The drama of “The Man Machine” works well with this, with specific highpoints occurring whenever the drum track drops out.

    Things bear up well with “Spacelab”, which again sounds great, especially towards the end and, in general, when there are no vocals. I can remember “The Model” being a single and always liked it but it feels out of place on the album and the archive footage of catwalks only serves to make it seem more so but, irrespective, it's a good song. Then the album takes a dive with “Neon Lights”: a tedious song coupled with very thin percussion sounds.

    This is followed by the “problematic” “We Are The Robots”; on stage this was a coup de théâtre with the band replaced by dummies but visually it doesn't work so well. Fortunately, the field of synth bleeps flying back & forth is very effective ... while the sounds are terribly dated, representing a step forward from the darker electronica of their earlier albums into sunny eighties Synthpop, the track does work well in surround.

    The final track, “Metropolis”, is another standout both in surround and 3D ... but this time the visuals definitely have the upper hand; concentrating on the music reveals how bland and repetitive it is, despite the thrilling sonics.

    This set is one of the best AV packages ever and listening to it is always a good time, but this is not the individual album that I would have chosen from it and I feel that it represents the band (already!) after they were “cool”. (Radioactivity would have been my selection. Either way, must-own and to me something of a bargain, even at the aspirational price.
  6. Sordel

    Sordel Forum Resident

    Midlands, UK
    Tales of Mystery and Imagination is an album that has a particular place in my heart. It was the first time I had heard the term concept album and the concept in question was an author who was then a youthful obsession. Suffice it to say, I wore out the vinyl at the time and then bought the inferior remix (on which this surround mix is unfortunately based!) when it was released at the end of the eighties. With the passage of time it no longer features in my top sixty albums of all time but in many respects it remains one of my “favourite” albums.

    Listening to “Dream/Raven” I'm instantly prompted to ask: where's the magic? The sonics are ordinary, the surround barely perceptible. It's a very good song, but oh-so-meh in this version so we have to wait for “The Tell-Tale Heart” before the album takes off. At least here the percussion has some life, and the soundfield before the second verse rewards the surround listener with a complex, layered mix.

    “The Cask of Amontillado” shows Woolfson & Powell at their best: a richly orchestrated ballad with a twist. The strings are nicely handled though to me the majority of the brass just doesn't sound true to life, which may be intentional but doesn’t suit me. Then that great segue to the riotous “System of Doctor Tarr and Professor Fether” which sounds exactly as it should (featuring fewer of Parsons's “second thoughts”). The flute line is completely buried towards the end ... just one more of the many small ways that he found to screw up the remix.

    The second side of the original album is dominated by the “House of Usher” suite, which here follows pleasingly without pause from the end of “Tarr/Fether”. I can live without the Orson Welles but ... okay. Then we get (still ludicrously uncredited after forty years) the Debussy Chute de la Maison Usher prelude. The organ at the start of “Arrival” is nicely articulated, with the rain and arpeggiator sounding as good as ever as we head into the brief section of the album most influenced by Pink Floyd. Next up: Andrew Powell gives us a little moment of Ligeti-esque scoring (more was to come on I Robot) before the rather lovely “Pavane” with the best surround, and acoustics, of the disc so far. The double bass, coupled with the interlocking keyboards, really sings, persuading me to unfold my arms (metaphorically) for the first time in this listening session. “Fall” never hits quite as hard as it should.

    “To One In Paradise” feels like an afterthought on the album but it's actually a pretty song and the surround mix is again good here, with the choir channeled all around and the complexity of the mix again scoring points. This is the song from this disc to use as a demonstration track.

    Overall, this is a disc with which I could easily dispense were it not for the fact that it contains the original stereo mix, which is better for the tracks that I most care about. Maybe it's confirmation bias, but I listened to the stereo version of “Dream/Raven” after finishing listening to the surround mix and it just sounds to me clearly better. I struggle to believe that it's simply nostalgia on my part ... listen to those emphatic drums at the end of “Dream” for instance. And ironically the auto-surround logic on my A/V receiver actually seems to me to make a better surround mix of the stereo than the dedicated 5.1 mix ... :ignore:
  7. riskylogic

    riskylogic Forum Resident

    It often happens that there are song or passages that I prefer on the stereo version. For example, the first half of the Ancient on Tales of Topographic Oceans is way better in the Wilson stereo mix. When I get my new system set up, I will have three choices:

    1) Straight stereo. My best amp and speakers will still be front left and right, so this may be the best option in many cases
    2) A surround mix. The main subject of this thread, so nuff said.
    3) Letting the AV receiver do it’s thing with the stereo mix. I was impressed with how good Voyage of the Acolyte sounded this way, so maybe I should do more of it.

    I figure on experimenting with Close to the Edge.
    jamesc and mark winstanley like this.
  8. Radley

    Radley Forum Resident

    San Francisco
    A few thoughts on listening to 5:1 mixes... I don't have 5 matched loudspeakers. I have a great left & rights, then added the center and surrounds of lesser quality. Movies & TV shows sound great. Then DVD-A & SACDs started becoming available and I started getting some of those. The thing is the 5:1 discs sounded too echo-y and then I realized I had on the delays for Dolby Digital. So I zeroed out the delays and things got better. I'd advise to consider that factor.

    I have The Band's Music From Big Pink in Robbie Robertson's 5:1 mix and it's nice but I think it loses so much so the glue that the original stereo mix had.

    Bob Dylan's Blonde On Blonde is pretty good but in 5:1 you can hear tiny mistakes from the musicians that probably wouldn't have been there if it was a real band that had toured with these songs before recording?

    Big, big shout out to Bruce Botnick for The Doors 5:1 box set.
  9. mark winstanley

    mark winstanley 5.1 should be mandatory for my favourite albums Thread Starter

    Often with a home theater set up, one of the things to watch for with settings, is that the "nighttime" or "compression" mode isn't on. That is useful for movies with way more dynamic range than required (ie head explodes with the bomb on screen, but you can't hear a word anyone says) but is really very distracting and damaging with music
    drum_cas and Radley like this.
  10. Dennis Metz

    Dennis Metz Born In A Motor City!

    Fonthill, Ontario
  11. mark winstanley

    mark winstanley 5.1 should be mandatory for my favourite albums Thread Starter


    Studio album by
    the Who
    17 May 1969
    Recorded 19 September 1968 – 7 March 1969
    Studio IBC in London
    Genre Hard rock rock
    Length 75:15
    Label Decca
    Producer Kit Lambert

    Tommy is the fourth studio album by the English rock band The Who, a double album first released in May 1969. The album was mostly composed by guitarist Pete Townshend, and is a rock opera that tells the story of Tommy Walker, a "deaf, dumb and blind" boy, including his experiences with life and his relationship with his family.

    Townshend came up with the concept of Tommy after being introduced to the work of Meher Baba, and attempted to translate Baba's teachings into music. Recording on the album began in September 1968, but took six months to complete as material needed to be arranged and re-recorded in the studio. Tommy was acclaimed upon its release by critics, who hailed it as the Who's breakthrough. Its critical standing diminished slightly in later years; nonetheless, several writers view it as an important and influential album in the history of rock music. The Who promoted the album's release with an extensive tour, including a live version of Tommy, which lasted throughout 1969 and 1970. Key gigs from the tour included appearances at Woodstock, the 1969 Isle of Wight Festival, the University of Leeds, the Metropolitan Opera House and the 1970 Isle of Wight Festival. The live performances of Tommy drew critical praise and rejuvenated the band's career.

    Subsequently, the rock opera developed into other media, including a Seattle Opera production in 1971, an orchestral version by Lou Reizner in 1972, a film in 1975, and a Broadway musical in 1992. The original album has sold 20 million copies and has been inducted into the Grammy Hall of Fame. It has been reissued several times on CD, including a remix by Jon Astley in 1996, a deluxe Super Audio CD in 2003, and a super deluxe box set in 2013, including previously unreleased demos and live material.
    Side one
    1. "Overture" Townshend 3:50
    2. "It's a Boy" Townshend 2:07
    3. "1921" Townshend, Roger Daltrey on chorus 3:14
    4. "Amazing Journey" Daltrey 3:25
    5. "Sparks" Instrumental 3:45
    6. "The Hawker" (Sonny Boy Williamson II) Daltrey 2:15
    7. "Christmas" Daltrey, Townshend in middle eight 5:30
    8. "Cousin Kevin" (John Entwistle) Entwistle and Townshend 4:03
    9. "The Acid Queen" Townshend 3:31
    10. "Underture" Instrumental 10:10
    11. "Do You Think It's Alright?" Daltrey and Townshend 0:24
    12. "Fiddle About" (Entwistle) Entwistle 1:26
    13. "Pinball Wizard" Daltrey, Townshend on bridge 3:01
    14. "There's a Doctor" Townshend, with Daltrey and Entwistle 0:25
    15. "Go to the Mirror!" Daltrey and Townshend 3:50
    16. "Tommy Can You Hear Me?" Daltrey, Townshend and Entwistle 1:35
    17. "Smash the Mirror" Daltrey 1:20
    18. "Sensation" Townshend 2:32
    19. "Miracle Cure" Daltrey, Townshend and Entwistle 0:10
    20. "Sally Simpson" Daltrey 4:10
    21. "I'm Free" Daltrey 2:40
    22. "Welcome" Daltrey, Townshend ("more at the door") and Entwistle (spoken part) 4:30
    23. "Tommy's Holiday Camp" (Keith Moon) Moon, with Townshend 0:57
    24. "We're Not Gonna Take It" Daltrey, with Townshend and Entwistle 6:45
    The Who started off in Acton London in 1964, and was initially Pete Townshend, Roger Daltrey and John Entwistle.
    Townsend and Entwistle were friends at school and played around with different music ideas. Initially trying to form a trad jazz bands with Entwistle on the French Horn. Entwistle moved to guitar, but felt that his fingers were too big for it and moved to bass after hearing the work of Duane Eddy.
    Roget Daltrey was a year older and from a much more working class background. He had moved to Acton from Shepherds Buch, and didn't really fit in at the school. He ended up being expelled and got drawn into gangs and rock and roll.
    Daltrey formed a band called the Detours in 1959, and over the time the band turned into the Who. Daltrey kept his eye on the money and the music in the Detours.
    Daltrey spotted Entwistle with a bass one day and recruited him for the band. Entwistle suggested that his friend Townshend join also as a guitarist.
    The band was then Townshend - guitar, Entwistle bass, Harry Wilson - Drums, Colin Dawson on Vocals, and Roger was the Lead Guitarist. Daltrey was considered the leader and, according to Townshend, "ran things the way he wanted them".
    During a gig with a stand-in drummer in late April at the Oldfield, the band first met Keith Moon. Moon grew up in Wembley, and had been drumming in bands since 1961. He was performing with a semi-professional band called the Beachcombers, and wanted to play full-time. Moon played a few songs with the group, breaking a bass drum pedal and tearing a drum skin. The band were impressed with his energy and enthusiasm, and offered him the job.
    The band's first manager was replaced by two filmmakers, Kit Lambert and Chris Stamp. They were looking for a young, unsigned rock group that they could make a film about, and had seen the band at the Railway Hotel in Wealdstone, which had become a regular venue for them.
    In June 1964, during a performance at the Railway, Townshend accidentally broke the head of his guitar on the low ceiling of the stage. Angered by the audience's laughter, he smashed the instrument on the stage, then picked up another guitar and continued the show. The following week, the audience were keen to see a repeat of the event. Moon obliged by kicking his drum kit over, and auto-destructive art became a feature of the Who's live set.
    By late 1964, the Who were becoming popular in London's Marquee Club, and a rave review of their live act appeared in Melody Maker. Lambert and Stamp attracted the attention of the American producer Shel Talmy, who had produced the Kinks. Townshend had written a song, "I Can't Explain", that deliberately sounded like the Kinks to attract Talmy's attention. Talmy saw the group in rehearsals and was impressed. He signed them to his production company, and sold the recording to the US arm of Decca Records, which meant that the group's early singles were released in Britain on Brunswick Records, one of UK Decca's labels for US artists. "I Can't Explain" was recorded in early November 1964 at Pye Studios in Marble Arch.
    There was a series of events that involved guys leaving and rejoining the band, Moon recording Beck's Bolero with Jeff Beck, the band falling out with Shel Talmy, and subsequently losing their contract ... it was a volatile early period. In which the band recorded several pretty successful singles, the most successful of which was My Generation. During this time their debut album also came out, also titled My Generation. Followed by an EP Ready Steady, Who.
    There were some financial struggles, and during this time the band came up with the Quick One, While He's Away album, where Kit Lambert had encouraged all the guys to write some songs Entwistle came up with Boris The Spider and Whiskey Man, but after they got their songs together they wer short ten minutes and Lambert encouraged Townshend to write a long piece, and so the title track was born.
    The band were doing some shows in the US, and Townshend got into a fight with Jimi Hendrix after accusing Hendrix of stealing his act. This led to the argument about who would go on first at Monterey and the Who went on first and got some US attention, with the single Happy Jack reaching the top 30.
    The next album was The Who Sell Out, and it is actually one of my favourite Who albums. It was a concept album based on Pirate Radio stations, who were the real supporters of popular music in England at the time, with the BBC being the only real radio station and tending not to play popular music.
    In 68 the band toured New Zealand and Australia, and things didn't go too well. They had a little trouble with the local authorities, and in New Zealand one paper called them "unwashed, foul-smelling, booze-swilling no-hopers".
    After an incident on the plane from New Zealand to Sydney Australia, the band were briefly arrested in Melbourne and then forced to leave the country the Prime Minister John Gorton sending them a telegram telling them never to return to the country..... and they didn't until 2004.....
    The underground press had taken an interest in the band, and Townshend had stopped taking drugs and become interested in the teachings of Meher Baba, which brings us to today's album Tommy.
    I have grown to like Tommy over the years, but have always considered it a slightly lesser album than many others in the band's catalog, which typically makes me an odd sock, but there you go. Obviously when the surround version of the album came out, I couldn't resist giving it a go, and I am pretty sure it is very well done, but as we keep discovering, it is a long time since I heard this one also :) So I am very interested to see what I reckon this morning, and also whether the album has drawn closer to my heart in absence :)

    There is a two dvd-audio set, a bluray and I think also an sacd, but be aware that not all the sacd's are going to be the surround version.
    The Bluray is available on Amazon for about $67, but there is only one
    The dvd -audio is available on discogs from about $24 The Who - Tommy
    The sacd is available on discogs from about $15 The Who - Tommy $26 The Who - Tommy $18 The Who - Tommy
    The dvd-audio is available on discogs from about $23 The Who - Tommy
    The Japanese sacd is available from about $40 on discogs The Who - Tommy
    The Bluray is available from about $34 on discogs The Who - Tommy

    I have the dvd-audio and I believe that all the mixes are the same, but please correct me if I am wrong about that.
    The second dvd-audio has some demos and outtakes in 5.1 and some more tracks just in hi-res stereo.
    The reissue was produced by Pete Townshend

    5.1 mix Pete Townshend
    Pre and post production consultants Elliot Mazer and David Pelletier
    Mastering Jon Astley

    So lets see what we have here

    Cymbals in the sides. Drums centred in the front left with a bit of width. Townshend's guitar is on the right side. The organ comes in in the rears.
    We get the acoustic guitar take over up front with the Townshend narration vocal, which has effect feeds to the sides.

    It's A Boy
    We move smoothly into it's a boy. And we get a little spread with the bovox on the very short track.

    Moving quickly into this track
    Guitar right side. Daltrey's contrary vocal is in the rears, and the bvox push into the sides. Drums up front.

    Amazing Journey
    We get some nice swelling around us, and the clicky synthetic sound moves around. Reverse guitar in the left rear.
    Some nice swoosh across the centre from a reverse guitar.
    Drums just right of front. Cymbals rears, including some reverse cymbals.
    This mix is very effective. We get some really nice guitars bits and pieces sliding across the channels, to and from various areas.
    There have been some off centre drums on here, but none of them sounding odd, or out of place.
    The mix has been nice, but this track really bring everything to life, like the album really starts now.

    Smoothly into this track.
    A nice sub assist. Tambourines rattles across the rears. Cymbals rears. Guitars either side. Percussion rears.

    Eyesight To The Blind (The Hawker)
    Bvox in the rears. Guitars either side.
    Daltrey is sort of in the middle of the room.

    One of my favourite tracks on here.
    Bvox in the rears.
    The basic set up on most of the tracks is up front, with the guitars just wide of being the stereo mix. It sounds very good.
    There are other bits and pieces in the mix, and the mix is immersive.
    "Tommy can you hear me" is in the middle of the room.
    Piano on the left side.
    Again the drums are just off centre, this time the left, but again it doesn't sound bad at all.

    Cousin Kevin
    Guitar right rear. Cymbals in the rear. Vocals again sort of in the middle of the room.

    The Acid Queen
    Vocals front with effects to the right rear.
    Guitar just left of front left.
    Cymbals rears.
    Keyboards front right around to right rear.

    Tambourine left rear. Cymbals rears. Guitars either side.
    Towards the end of the track, the guitars become a little more prominent in the rears.
    We end with a gong in the rears

    Do You Think It's Alright?
    To short to fully describe but immersive.

    Fiddle About
    Cymbals rears. Piano just left of front left horn sort of middle of the room slightly right.

    Pinball Wizard
    Guitars front and right rear.
    Electric guitar left side.
    Cymbals in the rears.

    There's A Doctor
    Piano just right of front right. Drums left side.

    Go To The Mirror!
    Piano just left of front left. Guitar right side. Townsend vocal left side. Bvox in the sides.

    Tommy Can You Hear Me?
    Acoustic guitars either side.
    Vocals all round.

    Smash The Mirror
    Vocals all round. Drums slightly to the right, cymbals rear. A keyboard left side.

    Drums slightly right. Cymbals rears.
    Acoustic gtr just left of left.
    Piano kind of across the middle.

    Miracle Cure
    Guitars either side.

    Sally Simpson
    Bvox rears
    Guitars either side. Cymbals rears.

    I'm Free
    Guitar just right of front right.
    Percussion in rears.
    Vocals just in front of front centre with bvox sort of across the middle.
    A guitar right side. Piano just left of front left.

    Acoustic guitars either side. "Oooooh's" right side.
    Piano front. Harmonica in the middle of the room. Percussion rears.
    Bvox all round.

    Tommy's Holiday Camp

    We're Not Gonna Take It
    Guitars either side. Drums just right.
    Whispered we're not gonna take it, across the rears.
    Organ right side.
    Piano just left of front left.
    This is a good mix using all the channels.
    The grouped vocal in the fronts and rears.

    See Me Feel Me / Listening To You
    Ahhh's rears.
    Vocals all round

    This is an unusual mix in some ways. It all sounds balanced, and is quite enjoyable. I would think someone who loves this album would probably really enjoy this.
    I think to some degree this album is so layered, that actually plucking out what is where, becomes quite difficult to some degree.
    The mix is immersive, but for me at least this morning, it was somewhat hard to tell exactly where everything is coming from. I think there is a bit of stuff in the middle of the room, which often makes it harder for me to discern where it is coming form.
    For the most part we are looking at a more to the front mix for the basic tracks, and then we are getting effects sends to the rears, with augmentations in the rears.
    Amazing Journey is probably the highlight so far as surround mixing goes with lots over overdubbed reverse effect guitar whooshing across the soundfield and such.
    The drums are often off centre, but I didn't find that distracting at all. I think with the cymbals in the rear for most of the album it gives it a feel of being all around us, with the main snare and tom strikes coming from a specific spot.
    It may sound like I don't like the mix, and that isn't my intent, it just seemed very difficult to pinpoint anything you could put your hat on,
    This isn't my favourite Who album, I know that seems to be an unpopular opinion, but I find the story, although quite groundbreaking for an album, a little out there, and some of the instrumental tracks ... Underture for example, a little drawn out, and in trying to build tension, kind of become a little repetitive to me.
    I do understand that this is some folks favourite album of all time, but I much prefer Quadrophenia.... I think because it has more focused songs, and I think Townshend had a better story, with a better fleshed out way of presenting it.
    Anyhow like I say, to me, this is a good mix, that I am sure anyone who loves this album would enjoy, but it is a little unusual in its mix.
    Also there are a couple of minor tracking sort of errors on the dvd-audio. I imagine that the bluray is smoother, but would need someone to confirm that. For example, when I started the disc, it clipped the beginning, but I pushed the back button and it started in the correct spot. Tommy Can You Hear me, appeared to have Daltrey's last Tommy clipped at the end also ... It was minor stuff, but slightly annoying none the less.
    I really would like someone else to give us some input on this one, because I was finding it hard to connect with this morning.
  12. mark winstanley

    mark winstanley 5.1 should be mandatory for my favourite albums Thread Starter

    Well damn ... I wouldn't complain about Emmylou at any time of day ... hang on... oh I see :)
  13. riskylogic

    riskylogic Forum Resident

    Fish Out of Water


    Studio album by Chris Squire
    Released 7 November 1975
    Recorded Spring and summer 1975
    Studio New Pipers (Virginia Water, Surrey, England) Morgan Studios (London, England)
    Genre Symphonic rock, progressive rock
    Length 42:30
    Label Atlantic
    Producer Chris Squire

    Fish Out of Water is the first studio album from the English bassist, singer and songwriter Chris Squire, released in November 1975 on Atlantic Records. The album was recorded during a period of inactivity by his progressive rock band Yes following the band's agreement that each member produce a solo album. Squire hired additional musicians to play on his, including Bill Bruford, Patrick Moraz, Mel Collins, his childhood friend Andrew Pryce Jackman, and an orchestra.

    Fish Out of Water was a moderate commercial success upon its release, reaching number 25 in the UK and number 69 in the U.S. Despite the album being well received by music critics, Squire would not release another solo album until Chris Squire's Swiss Choir (2007).

    In August 1975, the progressive rock band Yes ended their tour in support of Relayer (1974) and began a nine-month period of inactivity after they agreed to take time off for each member to produce a solo album. When the time was right for Squire to start work on his, he collaborated with Andrew Pryce Jackman, a childhood friend and former keyboardist and songwriter in their 1960s rock band The Syn, who assisted with the album's concept and arrangement of the music.[1] Over the course of sketching out the album Jackman also contributed some ideas to its composition. Because of this, Squire offered to give him some co-writing credits, but Jackman declined.

    The introduction to "Hold Out Your Hand" features an organ passage played on the church organ at St Paul's Cathedral, London by the cathedral organist Barry Rose. The organ continues throughout the song creating an original sound and revealing Squire and Jackman's experience together, as church choristers, in their boyhood. The title of "Lucky Seven" refers to the song being in 7/8 time signature. Musically, a melodic passage from Yes' song "Close to the Edge" re-appears in the finale of "Safe (Canon Song)". The closing passage on "Safe (Canon Song)" was played on the 4-string bass section of a double-neck guitar using only the pickups of the 6-string section.

    "Lucky Seven" was edited into a single by producer Tom Dowd which only saw a US release. "Hold Out Your Hand" was one of the few songs performed by Yes during their 1976 North American tour from the member's solo albums. With Squire on lead vocals, one critic at the concert wrote for Circus magazine: "Some ten thousand people responded to the Squire tune with a standing ovation". To further promote the album a promotional film of "Hold Out Your Hand" and "You by My Side" was filmed in a studio that featured a mime performance with Bill Bruford on drums, Yes keyboardist Patrick Moraz on keyboards, Jackman on piano, and an orchestra. The orchestra was formed of members of the London Symphony Orchestra who were on their way to work on another project, but Squire could only afford a short amount of their time, roughly half an hour for a mime performance, which cost £3,000.


    Chris Squire – lead and backing vocals, bass guitar, 12-string guitar (tracks 3 and 5)[1]
    Bill Bruford – drums, percussion
    Mel Collins – tenor saxophone (track 3), alto saxophone, soprano saxophone (track 4)
    Jimmy Hastings – flute (track 2)
    Patrick Moraz – synthesiser, organ on track 3
    Barry Rose – pipe organ (track 1)
    Andrew Pryce Jackman – acoustic and electric pianos, orchestration, conductor
    Julian Gaillard – strings leader
    John Wilbraham – brass leader
    Jim Buck – horns leader
    Adrian Bett – woodwinds leader
    Nikki Squire – backing vocals (track 1)

    Chris Squire – producer
    Greg Jackman – engineer
    Nigel Luby – assistant engineer
    Laurence Bernes – cover design and photography
    Phil Carson – overdubs, mastering
    Trevor Spencer – mastering
    Graham Preskett – mastering
    Brian Lane – front cover Polaroid photograph
    Peter Sinfield – suggestions for "Safe (Canon Song)"
    Trevor Spencer – finishing touches
    Graham Presket – finishing touches

    Track listing
    All tracks written, arranged and produced by Chris Squire.

    No. Title Length
    1. "Hold Out Your Hand" 4:13
    2. "You by My Side" 5:00
    3. "Silently Falling" 11:27
    4. "Lucky Seven" 6:54
    5. "Safe (Canon Song)" 14:56
    The 5.1 mix was first released in a pricey 2018 box set. It is still available: Amazon Amazon UK

    I got my copy from Amazon in December for about $75 shipped, which is close to the personal record for the most spent on a single disc I set with Abbey Road. They seem to want more for it now, but Amazon UK looks like it they have it for a little less, well as long as you don’t have to pay the VAT. The 5.1 mix is DTS and given who mixed it, it looks like I may have been Bruforded again:

    5.1 mix by Jakko Jakszyk

    1. Hold Out Your Hand

    Bass, drums and vocals in center, organ in surround, strings and other keyboards in front. Strings in surround at end

    2. You By My Side

    Vocals in center, drums, bass, and piano in front. Flute in surround, orchestra in surround.

    3. Silently Falling

    Oboe in front, flute moves around in surround then center then front. Vocals, bass and drums in center. Piano and background vocals in surround. Keyboards in front. Orchestra in surround, with some percussion reverbing in back. Guitar in surround.

    4. Lucky Seven

    Piano and bass in center, drums in front, strings in surround, vocals and sax in center, background vocals in surround.

    5. Safe (Canon Song)

    Orchestra in surround, piano in front. Vocals, drums, guitar in front. Passage with lead bass in center, surrounded by orchestra. Then drums added in front. Pretty cool. Ends with spacey bass / synthesizer duet with former in center and latter in surround.
    After the release of Relayer, Yes temporarily disbanded to go out and pursue solo projects. Most of the resulting albums were rather mediocre., and the band would never be the same again. Even though I had all of them on LP, the only two I replaced with a CD were Fish Out of Water and Steve Howe’s Beginnings. Fish is far and away the best of the bunch.

    The surround mix is again (i.e. like Feels Good to Me) rather conservative, or at least the use of the back speakers is. The rears are largely used for ambient layering, but since this album has a lot of that it keeps them fairly busy. I don’t think there are any examples on this album of an instrument being primarily mixed to the back. On the other hand, the use of the center channel is anything but conservative – it is used much more than usual. Hold Out Your Hand starts out sounding like a mono recording coming from the center speaker. Chris Squire’s bass is often mixed to the center channel – he plays on the high end a lot, so that works.

    On the whole, I really like this mix. It’s a great album, and Jakko didn’t do anything to detract from it. The bass surrounded by orchestra passages on both Silently Falling and Safe are the best parts from a surround standpoint.

    However, I am not going to say it was worth $75. If I wanted the vinyl that I can’t play then maybe it would be. Once the boxes are all gone, seems like a fair bet that it the DVD will appear as a stand-alone for more like $15 - which probably about what it is worth to anyone who just can't stand not having it. (2/3)
  14. Dennis Metz

    Dennis Metz Born In A Motor City!

    Fonthill, Ontario
    Alice Cooper.....Awesome mix:cheers:

    mark winstanley likes this.
  15. zobalob

    zobalob Forum Resident

    Glasgow, Scotland.
    The Tommy surround SACD also has 17 outtakes and demos on a second disc, 12 of which are mixed to 5.1.
  16. mark winstanley

    mark winstanley 5.1 should be mandatory for my favourite albums Thread Starter


    Studio album / live album by
    Miles Davis
    November 17, 1971
    Recorded February 6 and June 3–4, 1970, at Columbia Studio B in New York City; December 19, 1970 at The Cellar Door in Washington, D.C.
    Genre Jazz-rock, funk, jazz
    Length 101:56
    Label Columbia
    Producer Teo Macero

    Live-Evil is an album of both live and studio recordings by American jazz musician Miles Davis.[1] Parts of the album featured music from Davis' concert at the Cellar Door in 1970, which producer Teo Macero subsequently edited and pieced together in the studio.[2] They were performed as lengthy, dense jams in the jazz-rock style, while the studio recordings were renditions of Hermeto Pascoal compositions.[3] The album was originally released on November 17, 1971.[4]

    1. "Sivad" (15:13)
    (Recorded December 19, 1970 at The Cellar Door, Washington, DC & May 19, 1970 at Columbia Studio B, New York, NY)

    2. "Little Church" (3:14)
    (Recorded June 4, 1970 at Columbia Studio B, New York, NY)

    3. "Medley: Gemini/Double Image" (5:53)
    (Recorded February 6, 1970 at Columbia Studio B, New York, NY)

    4. "What I Say" (21:09)
    (Recorded December 19, 1970 at The Cellar Door, Washington, DC)

    5. "Nem Um Talvez" (4:03)
    (Recorded June 3, 1970 at Columbia Studio B, New York, NY)

    6. "Selim" (2:12)
    (Recorded June 3, 1970 at Columbia Studio B, New York, NY)

    7. "Funky Tonk" (23:26)
    (Recorded December 19, 1970 at The Cellar Door, Washington, DC)

    8. "Inamorata and Narration by Conrad Roberts" (26:29)
    (Recorded December 19, 1970 at The Cellar Door, Washington, DC)

    Ok, so I know absolutely nothing about this album, and merely bought it on the strength of the other Miles surround releases that I have.
    Sketches Of Spain - In a Silent Way - Bitches Brew - also Kind Of Blue and Tutu, which we haven't looked at yet.

    From Wiki
    By 1971, Davis had signed a contract with Columbia that paid him $100,000 a year (US$631,306 in 2019 dollars[59]) for three years in addition to royalties.[143] He recorded a soundtrack album (1971's Jack Johnson) for the 1970 documentary film about heavyweight boxer Jack Johnson, containing two long pieces of 25 and 26 minutes in length with Hancock, McLaughlin, Sonny Sharrock, and Billy Cobham. He was committed to making music for African-Americans who liked more commercial, pop, groove-oriented music. By November 1971, DeJohnette and Moreira had been replaced in the touring ensemble by drummer Leon "Ndugu" Chancler and percussionists James Mtume and Don Alias.[144] Live-Evil (1971) was released in the same month. Showcasing former Stevie Wonder touring bassist Michael Henderson, who replaced Holland in the autumn of 1970, the album demonstrated that Davis's ensemble had transformed into a funk-oriented group while retaining the exploratory imperative of Bitches Brew.

    This quad 2-disc sacd is brand new and so therefor still available
    Amazon has it for $83.99 as a pre-order ... ?
    There are some on Ebay from about $45 Miles Davis Live Evil quad sacd | eBay
    I got mine direct from cd Japan for about $45 Miles Davis: SACD Multi Hybrid Edition of "Live-Evil" Japanese Original Release

    As with all these Japanese quads, the presentation is very nice, and although I am completely unfamiliar with the album, I expect that it will sound good.

    Quadrophonic sound engineer and remix Ray Moore

    Lets see what I haven't gotten myself into here.....

    Cymbals all around. Drums up front.
    The bass sounds excellent.
    There is a kind of hiccup sound that is coming from alternating front left and right.
    Guitar left side.
    Miles trumpet starts off sounding nothing like a trumpet.
    There are some sounds on here that sound like precursors to hip hop.
    There is a whistling sound left side and then from right.
    A groaning sound just left of front.
    A keyboard rhythmic riff, zig zags around the speakers really nicely.
    We have a series of movements here.
    The first is a very cool funky thing. Then it mellows a little.
    Then we get a solo piano and percussion just left of front left, in a very minimal arrangement.
    A cool sound comes in on the right side.
    There are some very cool sounds on here, and I can't tell you what they are.
    Miles' way trumpet is very cool, and different sounding.
    The mix is really nice. Balanced and interesting.
    The trumpet goes nude, and we get some of those cool high pitched notes.
    A vocalist on the left side.
    McLaughlin takes a lead on the left side, you can even hear the amp buzz.
    A wah wah insyrument... keys just right of front right.
    We get percussion bits coming in on the left side also.
    Jarret takes a keyboard lead, and the keys are front left across to right side.
    The bass has nice presence.
    Miles squawks and it is in a few different spots, we fade on Miles pushing out a flurry of notes.

    Little Church
    Organ on the left and also spreading across to the right side. Someone whistling in front of the front.
    Very melancholy and mildly disturbed feel.
    Percussion rears.
    Horn left rear.

    Gemini/Double Image
    Guitar front left. Percussion right side.
    Unusual sound left rear. Keys high pitched stone on right.
    Horns either side.
    An unusual atmospheric track, but from a surround perspective there is definitely a nice spread of instruments. That still manage to maintain coherence.
    The unusual honking sounds are either percussion or string scrapes.
    Rhodes keys on the right.
    Underpinning the unusual soundscape is a sort of subtle funky beat. The beat kind of develops and becomes more obvious as the track progresses.

    What I Say
    Nice drum intro and a bass comes in up front with either a send of support right rear.
    Percussion right rear.
    A more uptempo thing here.
    Keys across the front actually spreading to the right side. This is a cool groove.
    I didn't realise Jarret had worked with Miles.
    Guitar right side.
    Trumpet front sliding to right rear and back.... not sure if it is an effect or mixing thing. It does sound good though.
    Cymbals in the rears. Sax takes a lead up front.
    The percussionist is busy on this track.
    Dejohnette is tearing it up here.
    McLaughlin gives us a frenetic lead that is coming from the front and left side, again whether by effect send ir mixing trick, I don't know.
    Flute comes in on the right side.
    Electric piano takes a lead and it is front left across to centre.
    This is a frantic kind of track.
    A percussion instrument comes in on the right.
    The drums take over and get the whole soundfield. It is a full on barrage of drums.
    The percussionist comes back in to the right rear.
    The keys come back in up front with a cool keyboard riff.
    Miles takes us home with some honks and a held note.

    Nem Um Talvez
    Percussion right rear. Vocal up front.
    Keys up front.
    Keys left side. Trumpet front.
    A mellow kind of semi-ambient track.
    It has the feel of a kind of eulogy.

    Horn on the left. This sounds like it develops from the last track.
    Vocal up front.
    Organ up front.

    Funky Tonk
    Drums start us off here. Percussion in a couple of spots. Keys across the middle.
    I think it is trumpet, but it has a guitar-like sound up front, with effects sends to the rears.
    Cymbals rears and sides. Percussion in the right rear.
    A sax up front with a feed to the right rear.
    It is like the keys are left, right sides and front.
    McLaughlin comes in just left of front left.
    Percussion sound right rear.
    Vocalising comes in up front.
    Keyboards stuff is happening from the front left to right rear.
    Different percussion comes in, in the rears.
    We get a mellow section, with the bass holding it down, keys front right and left side.
    Miles plays some staccato sections.
    We move into a groove with more definition and Miles gets the wah trumpet happening again.
    Then it breaks down to just the keys. It sounds like three keyboard tracks, either side and front.
    We break into a groove again, and then it's over.

    Inamorata and Narration by Conrad Roberts
    Percussion right rear.
    Keys left side and front.
    Wah trumpet front with feed to right rear.
    This has a funky groove to it.
    Cymbals in the rears.
    Sax front right with a feed to right rear.
    Guitar right side.
    Cool percussion sound about 11 minutes in in the right rear.
    Miles comes back in on the way trumpet around 14 min. mark.
    By the 15:30 mark we have a virtual frenzy that is calmed by the percussion and cymbals settling down for a minute. Around 16:30 we mellow right down, and a whistle cries out on the right.
    Around 17, we have this slow, sort of staccato this going on. Drums up front, percussion right rear, and Miles holding fort. McLaughlin throws some interjections in on the left side.
    Then the sax comes in around the 19:15 mark to hold the leading instrument position.
    We are kind of in a slow funk blues here.
    A close mic'd spoken vocal comes in up front, and the music sits underneath, this runs roughly from 23 to 24 mins.
    The music fades back up, with a slightly different sound. We have the wah trumpet taking the lead and we come to a close.

    Probably the first thing to note is that this isn't going to be everybody's cup of tea. The freeform type of styling, and the extended jams are going to annoy and/or bore some people. This isn't pop or rock music, it isn't even closely related to pre 1968 jazz. This is Miles and crew taking it the next level after In a silent way and Bitches Brew. So if you are vaguely interested, but don't know this album, give youtube or something a go and have a listen.
    The album has very good sound, there are a couple of spots where some cymbals may be overloading the channels a little, but it could also just be that there is so much information there, that it is just really intense.
    The quad mix is excellent, and keeps the interest up very well. We have full use of all four speakers in the quad field, and there is certainly coherence between the levels, and the what everyone is trying to do.
    So, like I say, I reckon those that love this period of Miles work and surround sound, are probably going to want this. If you are more into rock and pop, this probably isn't going to suit you, unless you're smoking some nice doobies, and can switch into another zone to absorb this.
  17. mark winstanley

    mark winstanley 5.1 should be mandatory for my favourite albums Thread Starter

    I really enjoy this album and mix. Hopefully we will get to it soon! We still need to get into this and the Muscle Of Love Quad
    jeffreybh likes this.
  18. mark winstanley

    mark winstanley 5.1 should be mandatory for my favourite albums Thread Starter

    Fly by Night

    Studio album by
    February 15, 1975
    Recorded January 1975
    Studio Toronto Sound Studios
    (Toronto, Ontario, Canada)
    Genre Hard rock heavy metal progressive rock progressive metal
    Length 37:38
    Label Mercury
    Producer Rush Terry Brown

    Fly by Night is the second studio album by Canadian rock band Rush, released in February 1975 on Mercury Records. It was the first Rush album to showcase elements of progressive rock for which the band has become known. It was also the first to feature lyricist and drummer Neil Peart.

    • Alex Lifeson – electric guitars, 6- and 12-string acoustic guitars
    • Neil Peart – drums, percussion
    • Geddy Lee – bass guitars, classical guitar, vocals
    • Rush – production, arrangement, cover concept
    • Terry Brown – producer, engineer, arrangement
    • John Woloschuk – assistant engineer
    • Gilbert Kong – mastering at Masterdisk, New York
    • Eraldo Carugati – cover painting
    • AGI Chicago – art direction
    • Jim Ladwig – art direction
    • Joe Kotleba – design
    • Richard Fegley – photography
    • Howard "Herns" Ungerleider – By-Tor characters inspiration
    • Moon Records – executive producer
    1. "Anthem" Geddy Lee, Alex Lifeson 4:26
    2. "Best I Can" *Lee* Lee 3:24
    3. "Beneath, Between & Behind" Lifeson 3:00
    4. "By-Tor & the Snow Dog"
    • I. "At the Tobes of Hades"
    • II. "Across the Styx"
    • III. "Of the Battle"
      • i. "Challenge and Defiance"
      • ii. "7/4 War Furor"
      • iii. "Aftermath"
      • iv. "Hymn of Triumph"
    • IV. "Epilogue"
    Lee, Lifeson 8:37
    5. "Fly by Night" Lee 3:20
    6. "Making Memories" Lee, Lifeson 2:56
    7. "Rivendell" Lee 5:00
    8. "In the End" *Lee* Lee, Lifeson 6:51

    The Lyrics are by Neil Peart except where noted *Lee*
    So far we have looked at 2112 - A Farewell to Kings - Hemispheres and Moving Pictures.
    Today we are going to look at Fly By Night. I'm giving this one a listen today because we have just gotten to this album in our Rush Album by Album by Song thread ... here is the reference guide so far.

    The bands second album was a big step forward from the debut, and I like it a lot. I do prefer many of the later album, but this was where the band really stepped up and made something of themselves. The debut was solid, but it was a little more simplistic and it reflected a lot of their influences, possibly slightly too closely, but has enough personality of its own to be worth having a listen.
    Here we get the introduction of Neil Peart into the band on the drums, and also handling the majority of the lyrics.
    Between the other albums we have done here, and the album thread, there isn't much more really needs saying ..... so

    This bluray audio is apparently currently unavailable new.
    It is on discogs from about $16 Rush - Fly By Night
    Elusive Disc says it will be available on 2/28/202 for about $30 Rush Fly by Night Blu-Ray Pure Audio Disc
    Acoustic sounds says it is back-ordered and comes with a download card for about $30 Rush-Fly By Night-Blu-ray Audio|Acoustic Sounds

    5.1 mix Richard Chycki
    Remastered by Andy VanDette
    (I assume this means for the 5.1 also)

    We start with everything up front, and effects feeds to the sides.
    When the change comes in after the intro, the guitar spreads across the middle.
    During the lead break we are back all up front. During the doubled section we have the second lead on the right.
    The bass is clear. Drums are centred everything is clear and audible.
    The delays on the guitar and vocal appear in the sides.

    Best I Can
    The guitar comes in the sides.
    We do have a nice subtle assist from the sub for bass and kick.
    Lead nicely in the front.

    Beneath Between and Behind
    The three point guitar set up, front and sides.

    By-Tor and the Snow Dog
    We get the same three point guitar mix.
    We get the effect gtr in the left rear, and the grumbly voice thing in the right rear.
    During the riff we get the reverb sends in the rear, and the slide gtr effects in the left.
    The flanged drums roll from right side to left side.
    Some bell sounds in the left rear. Cymbal also.
    The volume swell chords are back to the three point mix.
    The lead is front and centre, with the other guitar left front.
    This section ends with some nice delay effects in the sides.
    Chimes fade out left side.

    Fly By Night
    Three point guitar set up again.
    The flanged? Vocal

    Making Memories
    Acoustic guitars either side. Vocal front and centre.
    Slide guitar lead up front.

    Acoustic guitar up front.
    Vocal to the left.
    Volume swells in the rear right.

    In The End
    Cymbal swells right rear, then left.
    Vocals and guitar front with sends to sides.
    The we get the three point guitar again.
    The percussive rhythm guitar is right side.
    Lead front and centre.
    Nice vocal delay in the rears just before the end.

    This isn't a revolutionary mix, that isn't Chycki's thing, but it, like most of the other mixes, is pretty solid. What we fail to get in 5.1 wizardry, is made up for by depth of sound.
    The use of the guitars in the sides is effective.
    I personally like this, but still feel it could have been a little more interesting. To some degree Chycki is restrained by what he has to work with, due to the fact that although the band do play some fairly complicated stuff, they generally have somewhat minimal instrumentation. Here we get extra guitars and effects sends and such in the sides. I think the album sounds very good, and we are definitely getting more than just a stereo field, but we aren't going to be challenging the really hi end 5.1's for amazing 5 channel representation, and where applicable movement.
    I enjoy this. I think any Rush fan that approaches this disc bearing in mind what I say here, will probably enjoy the mix as well.
    I really do hope that Permanent Waves, Grace Under Pressure and Power Windows get 5.1 treatments (also probably some later albums, but I am yet to hear those) and I hope either Chycki can raise the bar somewhat, or somebody else comes in to do them, because there is definitely more layers involved in those albums, and they should be represented as such.
  19. Trainspotting

    Trainspotting Senior Member

    Los Angeles
    Thanks, Mark!
    Just ordered Live Evil. If it's anywhere near as good, sound-wise, as the quad Bitches Brew, I'll be happy.
    fredblue, GerryO and mark winstanley like this.
  20. Åke Bergvall

    Åke Bergvall Forum Resident

    Karlstad, Sweden
    Actually, there's two diffrerent mixes: in addition to the Townshend mix found on the DVD-audio (and sacd I belive), the Blu-ray was newly mixed to 5.1 in 2013 "by Bob Pridden and Robert Rosenberg at FX London." Pete Townshend is the producer for this version. I own both versions but have not listened to either for a while, even if I recall that the 2013 mix sounded better, not surprising perhaps since Pete is virtually deaf on one ear, which to my mind would hamper any mixing into surround. Indeed, he has more than once said that he prefers the mono mixes of The Who's output.
    mark winstanley likes this.
  21. Mister Charlie

    Mister Charlie "Music Is The Doctor Of My Soul " - Doobie Bros.

    Aromas, CA USA
    Great review of Tommy. I too am not a big fan of this album, I don't even know half the songs on it. But I own the 5.1 and while I haven't listened to it in a long time I recall it being an alright mix, made the whole a bit more interesting with the surround.
    zobalob, Jarleboy and mark winstanley like this.
  22. riskylogic

    riskylogic Forum Resident

    Who, The - Tommy. I'm not a big fan of this album either. Who's Next is a classic, Quadrophenia is pretty good too, but after that I'm not sure I need anything from The Who but a good singles collection. I have a bunch of Warner DVDAs that I got circa 2005. For the most part, they are adequate but nothing special in surround. Brothers in Arms was one of them and this is another. 1/2

    Re Fly By Night, I really like this album, but I'm thinking Rush isn't good investment of surround dollars. Now, if a Grace Under Pressure came about, I'd be tempted. I think the Geddy Lee synthesizer era would be more conducive to a good surround mix.
    Jarleboy and mark winstanley like this.
  23. mark winstanley

    mark winstanley 5.1 should be mandatory for my favourite albums Thread Starter

    If you find the time at some point, I am sure folks would love a rough run down of the alternate version :righton:
  24. Trainspotting

    Trainspotting Senior Member

    Los Angeles
    They go into detail concerning the two mixes on the Quadraphonic forum, with the 2003 Townshend mix getting a better rating. Neither mix is considered great though.
  25. fredblue

    fredblue Surrounded by Music

    London, England
    there is no specific Quad engineering credit on the Illuminations SQ Quad LP but pretty sure it would've been mixed by Glen Kolotkin who co-engineered the Illuminations album and mixed a number of Santana's albums into Quad at that time.

    afaik Lotus was mixed in Japan (i don't know who by).. the Abraxas, Love Devotion Surrender, Santana & III Quads were by Larry Keyes (who as an in-house CBS engineer almost always received a Quad credit, whereas guys like Kolotkin would be more hit and miss they'd get a mention) and Fred Catero took over for the final Quads, Amigos & Festival.
    Last edited: Jan 26, 2020

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